Jun 04 23:16:24 106 PA - Amber and Vixen Debate
From Chronicles
The current game time is: Sat Jun 04 23:16:24 106 PA.
Vixen is settled at a table near to the dance floor this Saturday evening, a glass near to hand and a cig dangling between her lips. It ashes ever so slowly as she leaves it be, watching the dancers with thoughts passing behind her eyes. Her relaxed expression, however, gives few clues as to just what she sees or seeks. But she's in a sort of zone, the reach for her glass done without a need to look. The cig drawn casually from her lips before she swallows a mouthful of her pink tinged liquor.
Amber walks through the front entrance of the Alibi easily, her pistol handed over with a smile. A quick wave gets her past the bouncer, and she finds her self in the middle of the crowd. She short, so she's bounces up to tip toes a few times as she looks around, head peeking over shoulders as she tries to find anyone she might know. She fails, and decides to relocate, hitting the bar quickly for a drink before resuming her search. Spotting Vixen brings a wash of varying emotions over her face, and she settles on compassion as she approaches the other woman. She's almost apologetic when she nears and speaks, "Oh Vix, I just heard, are you ok?" she winces a bit, "I'd have tried to track you down sooner but..." she doesn't finish.
Vixen looks up a little when Amber comes over, a brow cocked slightly. "Heard what?" Asked casually before she shrugs and murmurs, "I'm fine.. just fine." Perhaps not really, but she says so anyway. "Go on and have a seat. I ain't exactly been that easy to pin down as of late. Got shit to do most days. And a new place."
Does as she's asked as she sits before you, her eyes large as she looks over at you, "I'm sorry all the same. I don't know whats gotten into Leo, but I think you gave him more a chance then he deserved, after that whole other thing." she takes a deep breath, and shuts her self up with a drink from her beverage, "Where are you living now? All the moving must have really sucked."
Amber Does as she's asked as she sits before you, her eyes large as she looks over at you, "I'm sorry all the same. I don't know whats gotten into Leo, but I think you gave him more a chance then he deserved, after that whole other thing." she takes a deep breath, and shuts her self up with a drink from her beverage, "Where are you living now? All the moving must have really sucked."
"Coventry. Me and Maya are sharing a place there," Vixen replies. She then shrugs faintly and murmurs, "I suppose he's not caring much, now that he can shop around like he wants. And it ain't like I'm not used to finding the fuck ups and assholes all the time." She points at Amber. "That's why you hold on to your boy.. ain't too many good guys out there. Most are just idiots." She shrugs then and glances at the dancers. "But its done now.. and I'm fine."
"He can be an idiot at times too, but he's pretty good about learning from his mistakes," she offers shrugging, taking another drink from her cup, seeming to need something to take her edge off, "You'll find someone, you have alot to offer, but those magic types, they really can't be trusted. Too much power corrupts, they say, people shouldn't have that sorta..." she shivers, bit over dramatic, "So what have you been doing to keep yourself busy?"
Vixen shakes her head slightly. "I ain't looking for now men no more," she states. "I got enough troubles to deal with right now and I'm starting to think maybe they're more trouble than they're worth." She then looks to Amber and notes, "Trying to get the refugees settled. Though, just to make that last week all the more wonderful, the council decided to completely derail my plans up to now. Wasn't that just fucking nice."
"Oh? What happened?" she seems happy for the change in topic, "What's not to like about helping out people who need help?" she does a bit more damage on her drink, large eyes wide and attentive as she drinks slowly from her straw, hands pushing her cup back and forth a bit.
"Long story short, rather than starting a nice, near little village near Kingsdale, I'm limited to settling them in the Dregs, or outside of Kingsdale's range or at Laramy.. or something." Vixen shakes her head slightly. "Lesser options. It really ain't my choice, but I think I know what they'd chose if they could chose from all of those options. I know what I'd choose." Her eyes shift back to the dancers and she lifts her cig once more to take a slow drag before casually offering it up. Not a normal cig, that. Weed, rather than the normal mishmash that are normal smokes.
Amber shakes her head when offered, reaching into her own hoody to pull out a well worn pack of smokes herself. She takes one and lights it before putting her implements on the table, her eyes closing as she leans back and takes a long, slow drag, "Oh man, Its hard not smoking around Zach sometime, but I just can't see myself giving it up." she takes another hit and ashes off to the side before leaning in again, "Can't really blame though, can you? Who'd pay for a group of strangers to setup shop right next store? Better to keep them close, or adopt them into a group thats already established, wouldn't it?"
"They wouldn't be paying shit, I was handling it without looking for any outside help," Vixen notes. "And I was hoping to help them be productive. Now.. they can't grow shit in the Dregs. So what are they going to do?" She shakes her head and shrugs. "Mot to mention trying to get them settled there. Going to be like tossing them back into a warzone." She snorts faintly and murmurs, "I just hope this won't turn into a clusterfuck." She lifts her cig, taking a draw off it.
"Turn into one?" Amber shakes her head, taking a hit from her smoke and blowing out 5 small rings, "You've got a much better outlook on things than I do, I guess." she finishes her drink, letting the glass filled with ice fall back to the table as she looks at you, "What are people in the dregs going to do now that their is all extra competition for the small jobs they used to live on? Things are bad, and its just gonna get worse, I think."
"Like I said, I don't know what they're going to do," Vixen replies. "Tirzah seems to have some plan up her sleeve, but I think she's planning to use the refugees to forward her own schemes. She thinks she can improve the Dregs. I don't thinks he has any idea what she's dealing with. My only focus is getting those people settled and stable. No room in that for crazy schemes."
Amber watches you, her mind turning as she sits their, letting her gaze seem to stare through you. She shakes her head suddenly, and enjoys a bit more of her smoke, letting it out through the corner of her mouth, "Settled and stable? I hate to say it, but why not help those already here get settled and stable? Cause you can't really. And its gonna be hard to take care of all the people that are gonna be coming down from Tolkeen, and a lot of those people are going to be coming down specifically to take advantage of these people." she shakes her head, "I don't know," she says sighing, "Its a tricky thing to deal with, dealing with outsides when so many of your own are in trouble."
"My own can do their own shit," Vixen notes. "I got out. Hell, I'm living in a place in Coventry right now.. if you'd have told me that a few years ago, I would have said you were fucking nuts." She jabs her cig a little in Amber's direction. "Maybe its harder for some, but not for everyone. People can rise up. Them Tolkeen people got less right now and they don't know how to survive like Dregs folk do. Right now they need the help more."
"A slippery slope, that. Putting yourself in charge of determining whose need is more real and pressing? A lot of potential for abuse their, even if its just applying your morals on a community that might not share them." she leans back again, blushing a bit as she finds herself playing devils advocate, "I'm sorry, I'm not sure whats gotten into me, I shouldn't be questioning you, I've no right." she takes a hit from her smoke and puts it out in the ashtray, the smashing of the butt done with more effort than needed, "What do I know anyway, right? I'm just a kid."
"Do I look like some kinda granny to you?" Vixen's amused response. "I'm not forcing my views on no one. When it comes to the refugees, you gotta look long term. There are over 300 of them out there right now. But there are gunna be more. And more and more. As long as the Coalition is fighting Tolkeen, there will be more coming. They can't sit outside the city with no food. Otherwise a new Dregs will be forming up right outside the city. The refugees are self motivated and want to work and make a new life. They can he helped easier than most people in the Dregs. And with less resources, which I don't' got a lot of right now. Besides, people with more money and influence than me have been trying to change the dregs for a long time. Ain't one of 'em made much a dent since before I was born. I like to have confidence in me and what I can do, but I know when something just ain't worth it."
"This batch maybe, but what about the next thousand, or the thousand after that? How many do you help? How many is an ok amount of people to save before you have to worry about the Coalition swinging down to take care of us next? Whykin is just over the hill, and you better believe they're getting more and more nervous as more and more people come. The government here has an impossible task. I'd like to think i'm pretty smart, and all I have are these few questions, and i've only just really started thinking about this. I can't imagine the sort of things that a Dictator has to worry about. Nothing is black and white, I know that for sure."
Vixen snorts faintly at that. "I think the Coalition has more to worry about with Tolkeen itself and the Federation of Magic to worry about a few refugees that ran rather than fighting." She shakes her head slightly. "That's the bullshit reason I got from the council for why I couldn't settle them near Kingsdale, but I don't buy it. Besides, they got plenty of reasons to come after Kingsdale without using some refugees as an excuse. But they haven't ."
Amber smirks, "Now who's thinking short term? Yet? Thats adequate for you? They haven't so they won't? That's the weak, Vix, and you know it. They're gonna win, and a then what? Power's gonna make them pick off potential threats before they're threats. Thats us. With Whykin about to join them? Thats totally us. I'm scared, and you should be too." Another cigarette finds its way to her lips, and her face is still fairly bright. If one didn't know better, they might think she's enjoying herself.
"We don't know what's going to happen, chick. And you think I don 't know this place could get rolled over?" She snorts and makes a casual motion with her cig holding hand. "The Coalition can flatten this place easy. Everyone knows it. Don't mean they'll bother, but it don't mean I'm not prepared. My operation is strictly portable and I got my little highwayman to get me somewhere I can settle." She lifts up her glass."They could have done it before, but they didn't. And after this fight, even if they win, they're gunna be weak. Tolkeen ain't the only one out there that hates 'em and there will always be bigger fish to fry. I doubt some refugees are going to be the sudden thing that makes them want to take out Kingsdale." And she drinks, tossing back the glass to finish it off, landing it firm on the table afterward.
"And you're willing to bet everone's life on that, for 300 people? 300 strangers?" she shakes her head, "Yeah, you're hearts in the right place, for sure, but no way those numbers add up. I'm honestly not that surprised they don't want to take risks, I sure wouldn't. I guess I just never underestimate the crazy that is the Coalition. And with those new bots they got?" she shivers again, "I'm just saying, you can't expect a government to put the well being of strangers who made their own mess before the well being of its citizens. They want to try to add something to this city, then sure, but Hook them up and let them do their own thing?"
"Two things," Vixen says, cig going between her lips so she can count these two things off on her fingers. "First, more than 300 now. Probably a few thousand at least before this shit is over." She then pokes another finger, :Two, you think they're just going to disappear if you ignore them? No, they'll still be out there. Hungry and dying. Prime fodder for exploitation, a source of crime and instability that will add to the mess of the city. If Kingsdale had the balls to run them off, they would have done it already as an example. They ain't going to do it so no matter what you do with them, they're going to be here. Its just a matter of if you let them drag things down or if you take those idle hands and put them to work."
Amber giggles a bit, grabbing at her drink only to put it down as she realizes it's just melted ice, "Whats the thresh hold? How many lives until its worth the risk? What sort of guarantees that these people aren't just the ones who bailed when things got a little difficult. Do we really want a bunch of people who were so non invested in their old homes to have our help? Whats to stop them from leaving again when the situation becomes unfavorable, all that help for nothing." she flags down the waitress, getting another drink, "If you're so sure they won't run them off, why not just do it anyway?"
"Their homes were destroyed by the Coalition. They didn't live in Tolkeen city, they lived out nearby. But if you wan to know for sure, go ask 'em yourself." Vixen jerks a thumb towards the north and the gates. "I've been around them. They're no looking for a handout. That's one reason I thought we could do this.. cause when the time came to build, I'd have hundreds of eager pairs of hands to do the actual work without having to pay contractors and laborers. With free conjured wood, it would have been easy. But now.." She shrugs. "I'm checking things out and trying to think up better ideas before I bring them the news. They're the ones to decide what they're going to do, I just help how I can."
"What other ideas you got going on? I can't believe that with all the people going up to Tolkeen to fight by their side, that their isn't more than enough work around here for them to have. If they're skilled, why can't they help us out? Prove their worth? Sacrifices are going to have to be made, and as much as it sucks, they're gonna have to make one first." her second cig get snuffed out as well, "And I know that losing their homes and coming here was a sacrifice, but we all got it bad."
"Help doing what? I had to go out personally to get some of them jobs on the farms. Not cause the people don't want to work, but cause people here don't want to give them work." Vixen eyes Amber firmly. "And like I said, I was planning on trying to get them to start their own farm. Provide for themselves and food for the city. Cause anyone can do that with a few people who know the ins and outs to teach. But in the Dregs? They can't do simple things there. I suppose Emily might have a rundown of the sort of talent we got there in particular, but if no one in the city wants to employ them, how can they help out? You're starting to sound like the rest of 'em, chick.. all blame and bullshit, all demanding without giving. I'd have thought you might have more sense than that."
"So you're right, and everyone else is wrong?" she smirks, and is rescued by her drink arriving. A brief exchange with the waitress nets her a drink, which she drinks liberally from, "Sorry to be like the rest of them, but it seems like i'm not the only one who's got reservations, and again, i've only just started thinking about this tonight." she shrugs, "Its a cold world out there, and I know that better than anyone, but people don't get hand outs just because they're in need. We're all in need, and frankly, I think its bitchy as hell that you'd rather help strangers, than people in the dregs who've been suffering all along." she covers her mouth quickly as she speaks, knowing full well she's out of line.
Vixen narrows her eyes. "So the Coalition is right just cause they're bigger than us? You can stow that bullshit right there," Vixen states, prodding her cig at Amber again. "Majority only rules through power, not smarts. Sometimes the bigger they are, the dumber they get cause they lose sight of things." She leans back, eyes remaining firm on Amber. "I gave you my reasons for why I'm helping them. These people are motivated. They want to work, they don't' want handsouts. A little effort can go a long way with them. And all I got right now is a little. I can't help folks in the Dregs cause I don't got all that much money myself and the Dregs is a big cred sinkhole. There are lots of people trying to help the Dregs folk right now. Those soup kitchens and the Knight's Hospital. But the refugees got no one and nothing." She then leans forward, hands on the table as she eyes Amber. "And what about after if the Coalition comes down and takes out Kingsdale? Then we're the refugees. Personally, I'd rather people know that we gave people in need a hand up, rather than be the ones that let thousands of people die right outside our gates, cause who wants to help a pack of heartless fucks anyway?" Her expression a bit tight as she notes, "Reputation is worth more then creds, chick. And people are watching. Word travels fast. Think about that."
Amber seems content not to reply at all, instead sipping at her drink. She reaches into her hoody to retrieve another smoke, but decides against it as she looks around herself, "Listen, first, it doesn't matter if the Coalition is right or not, they're gonna win, and thats what's gonna make them right in the end...." she shakes her head, "I don't want to talk about this anymore, this is not the conversation i intended to have, I was just sorta ..." she finishes her drink quickly eyes seeming to be anywhere but on you.
Vixen grunts lowly. "Yeah, it ain't a good topic for now. Besides, it ain't your issue to worry about anyway. Its mine." She dips into a sullen sort of silence for a moment, eyes gravitating towards the dancers then. But talk doesn't take long to return after she takes a hit from her long neglected cig. "So I guess things are good with you and your boy.. what you been up to." The topic allowed to drop, Vixen completely bypassing it and dumping the emotions of the moment entirely. Though it leaves her with that sullen feel, the question lacking the sort of keen interest she's show before.
Vixen grunts lowly. "Yeah, it ain't a good topic for now. Besides, it ain't your issue to worry about anyway. Its mine." She dips into a sullen sort of silence for a moment, eyes gravitating towards the dancers then. But talk doesn't take long to return after she takes a hit from her long neglected cig. "So I guess things are good with you and your boy.. what you been up to." The topic allowed to drop, Vixen completely bypassing it and dumping the emotions of the moment entirely. Though it leaves her with that sullen feel, the question lacking the sort of keen interest she's show before.
"We're fine I guess, just the same sort shit I always find myself in. Too smart for my own good, too much ego, too sensative. Things are going going better than I'm used too for sure, so that real nice." she doesn't seem to eager to elaborate more than that as she finishes her second drink much more quickly than her first, "I'm mostly just workin, finding odd jobs around to suppliment my income at Cali's. Busy busy busy, I guess." her mood is radically changed now as well, closely mirroring that of the woman before her.
"I think we're getting the wrong topic going so lets try this.." Vixen leans forward and looks to Amber with her head canted. "What should we be doing right now so we can stop scowling at each other and have some fun?" She smirks faintly. "I've been in a funk too long.. I gotta break out of this shit. Got any ideas.. what'd you come here to do?"
Amber looks over at you and starts to blush, her reddening increasing as she looks down into her glass, seeming to study the ice located there, "Ums," she says, letting out a halk-hearted chuckle, eyes raising, "I sorta came out here to try to get boys to buy me drinks and swoon over me." she drinks some of her melted ice, "Its that just awful of me? "I was gonna be good, but sometimes its nice to feel appreciated."
"That's fucking bad," Vixen states, her mood turning quickly as a sore spot is brushed up against. "That's the shit Leo started with with me.. screwing around with other girls. If you're with someone, you're with someone. Maybe you let 'em look, but if you're close with someone you don't mess around on 'em. You'd best be real careful with that, chick. Real careful." She pauses then wonders, "Your boy don't appreciate you?"
"I don't know, I guess he does. Sometimes I think i'm just a pretty doll to him, or like I'm some sorta hopeless kitten he's rescued. He's just a lot older than me, and I don't know that he sees all that I am, or all that I can do. I don't feel he thinks i'm very smart sometimes, and he chastises me." she looks up, "Sorta like you're doin right now. Maybe i'm the one whose broke here, and not you two." A sigh escapes her lips as she swirls ice around in her glass.
"You've never really told me what you can do, so I don 't know, really. And I'm giving it to you straight, cause that's what I do with all of my girls. Just like I'd expect my girls to talk straight with me." She casually stubs out the butt of her cig and adds, "Everyone is probably broken in ways. Just look at me? Can't have a normal relationship even once." She snorts faintly. "Relax.. we're cool, you and me."
"I'm just really good with machines," she looks up, half-smiling, "I mean really good, not to just toot my own horn, but I learn fast, grasp concepts easily, and never ran into a job I couldn't do. And i'm pretty much self taught, so I think that counts for something." her pride is evident as she speaks, no trace of her being humble now, "I'm not say I got all the answers, but I tend to ask questions that people don't like tohear
"I'm just really good with machines," she looks up, half-smiling, "I mean really good, not to just toot my own horn, but I learn fast, grasp concepts easily, and never ran into a job I couldn't do. And i'm pretty much self taught, so I think that counts for something." her pride is evident as she speaks, no trace of her being humble now, "I'm not saying I got all the answers, but when i'm working, I sure seem to." her smile fades a bit, "I didn't get fancy education like Zach, and I think he judges me for that, like I can't possibly be smart because I didn't goto a school or some such."
Vixen nods, acknowledging Amber's words. "Me, I know computers and the streets. Mostly. Some other discreet talents that I don't like to advertise." She gives her shoulders a subtle roll. "Can't speak for your boy, but you seem bright enough. I don't mind the questions, cause they make me think. I might get a little hot in the argument, but I'm not dismissing things. I never told you to just shut up, I hit back cause that's what its all about. If I can't defend what I think, it ain't worth thinking."
Vixen nods, acknowledging Amber's words. "Me, I know computers and the streets. Mostly. Some other discreet talents that I don't like to advertise." She gives her shoulders a subtle roll. "Can't speak for your boy, but you seem bright enough. I don't mind the questions, cause they make me think. I might get a little hot in the argument, but I'm not dismissing things. I never told you to just shut up, I hit back cause that's what its all about. If I can't defend what I think, it ain't worth thinking."
"Oh yeah?" her eyes brighten, "I've been designing this AI, you have any experience with that?" she leans forward again, reaching out to grab a waitress as she passes ordering a 3rd drink before turning back to you, "Its so tricky, teaching it to teach itself, and its starting to walk, which is cool, but it bumps into stuff, so I guess it can't see yet." her smile has returnen, and her body language is much less standoffish, "I've yet to really run into anyone that can offer help, and I've not given up, but I'm not opposed to getting a hand."
"Don't know nothing about AI. I can take computers apart and put them back together. Make 'em sing, rewrite the software and destroy it, break security and rip out all the information in them.. that sort of thing." Of course, her voice dips discreetly when she reveals that last. "A thinking computer isn't something I wanna mess with, the less difficulty it takes to get in, the better."
"You can do that too!" she brightens, "People look at me weird when I talk about talkin to computers, they think i'm totally nuts. But its not, I say, its just how things are!" she hrms to herself, fingers drumming against the table as she considers something or another, "Something about AI is just so appealing! I wouldn't mind making a friend I can chat with, and who'll be all honest, and do what i tell him too!" she beams now, her thoughts not fully in the now as she seems to think on some aspect of what she's talking about.
Vixen furrows her brow. "I don't talk to computers. At least, not like I would talk to people. I can jack into them, but they're just ones and zeros, chick. I don't think making a friend is all that good an idea. You want friends that will be truthful with you, even when the truth hurts. Might be rough sometimes, but that's what life is. Rough."
Vixen furrows her brow. "I don't talk to computers. At least, not like I would talk to people. I can jack into them, but they're just ones and zeros, chick. I don't think making a friend is all that good an idea. You want friends that will be truthful with you, even when the truth hurts. Might be rough sometimes, but that's what life is. Rough."
"Oh? A computer is honest, all the time, crunch the numbers, spit out the result! No bullshit, no lies, no judging me on anything other than the info I put in. Thats real!" she waves her hand as she looks around the bar, "This is all fake, look at everyone, dolled up, lookin like they don't really look, trying to promote there own agendas. I wouldn't trust anyone I met here." She turns back to you, making a face, "And I don't really talk to them like a person either, " she frowns, "You're lookin at me like my dad used too. I can just ask questions to it, and just know the answers. Its not like we're chatting."
Vixen shakes her head slightly. "Computers tell you what you tell them to tell you," Vixen puts in. "And I dunno about this AI stuff, but you can't make a mind in a few days or a few years. You, me.. we get this way through life. But this is what makes us real. Life. Unless you're gunna let this.. computer intelligence live a life, it wont' be real. Not like you think it will, anyway." She shrugs a little and adds, "I'm not all dolled up and I'm not promoting nothing with you. And I'm not trying to talk down to you either. I'm just giving you my truth. Not to be better, but cause I think you can handle it."
"You're thinking normal computers, and thats fine, but a real AI, that can learn, and make choices, and do so faster than we can. Who knows how fast it could grow up, live like it wants. And who's to say its not real if I impose limitations on it." she frowns, "Was I less of a person, not as real, when i was locked up and told where to go and what to do?" she shakes her head, "I think how we deal with the hand we're dealt makes things real, and so would anything I make." She sighs, "I guess you just don't get what I'm saying. You're different, in that I know you, and you're here for reason I can't fathom." again she motions with her hand towards the crowd, "There are never absolutes, Vixen, but ninety percent of people here, I bet, have an angenda, and not just with me, just in general."
"Everyone had an agenda, chick. Even you. And if your computer intelligence is real, it would get one too. If it don't have one, it ain't real." Vixen grins a little. "Besides, agendas aren't always bad. I do think you've got the wrong idea when it comes to thinking this thing will give you the best advice. No one person or thing does. That's why you talk to a lot of people, get a lot of different views and compare them."
Drink number three arrives, and Amber smiles up at the waitress again, another brief exchange and she's ready to continue, "I guess I just need to shut up and do what is expected of me, be cute and docile. What do i know?" she pounds her drink, its down remarkably fast, and the glass hits the table, "Everyone's views seem to be the same, in the end, that i'm wrong, and my ideas are wrong" she stands quickly, "I'm not much in the mood for this, anymore, I think. I'm sorry things went down this way, but I think its best if I go home and just get sleep." she's not very convincing, but doesn't care as she spins, and starts to make her way through the crowd, towards the exit.
"Amber, c'mon now, girl," Vixen calls out. "It ain't like that. You think everyone always agrees with me?" Faintly amused. Though with the way she's drinking, Vix doesn't make a huge effort to get her to stay, just those words as he lingers at her table. Thoughtful as she looks after the other woman quietly.
Amber's too far gone, both mentally and drink wise, to turn around and comment, she's upset, and one would have to guess their is something a bit more going on. Still, she's uncharacteristicly bold in her exit, not at all the shy little girl most are used too.
